FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups  Who is OnlineWho is Online   Join! (free) Join! (free)  
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
  • Welcome
  • Guest

  • Main Menu
  • Sticky Articles
  • Open Support Tickets
textual criticism
Page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FREE FAITH, EXPRESSION AND THOUGHT Forum Index -> Christianity
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
ibnishaq
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 155


Location: USA
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:42 pm    Post subject: textual criticism  Reply with quote

ok i am a major fan of orthodox and coptic christianity. i also love chassadic judaism.

but do people not read about textual criticsm? about how the torah was written by 3-8 people(varying on your belief) and that it has been significantly changed?

i mean my god, there are 6,000 differences between masaeretic and samaritan! there are 4,000 between masaeretic and septuigant as well. and the dead sea scrolls only agree 60% with torah today. there is an isaiah there that is 2/3 bigger then isaiah today! oh, but i bet you never heard that huh?

i love christianity deerly do not get me wrong. but i mean what the hell dudes! i mean how can you believe in a mumble and jumble book?

sorry if i come across mean. today has been a VERY bad day for me. problem after problem after problem.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
BMZ
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 436



Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 4:37 am    Post subject: Re: textual criticism Reply with quote

ibnishaq wrote:
ok i am a major fan of orthodox and coptic christianity. i also love chassadic judaism.

but do people not read about textual criticsm? about how the torah was written by 3-8 people(varying on your belief) and that it has been significantly changed?

i mean my god, there are 6,000 differences between masaeretic and samaritan! there are 4,000 between masaeretic and septuigant as well. and the dead sea scrolls only agree 60% with torah today. there is an isaiah there that is 2/3 bigger then isaiah today! oh, but i bet you never heard that huh?

i love christianity dearly do not get me wrong. but i mean what the hell dudes! i mean how can you believe in a mumble and jumble book?

sorry if i come across mean. today has been a VERY bad day for me. problem after problem after problem.


I can see you had a very bad day. lol!

No one can blame Jesus (Esa) for the mess that the Christianity made. The man was just unfortunate in having the wrong and unintelligent guys as his disciples. They misinformed most of their followers and the rest of the confusion, chaos and doctrines was the ultimate result which makes all the thoughtful guys like you, including yours truly, shriek.

If you read my signature below, you would clearly see what kind of disciples he had. lol! Instead of two, there should have been at least twelve swords.  Laughing

The mother of all problems is the number of gospels and letters written. Add to that the book of Revelation, you get a disaster recipe of an unfathomable and unacceptable God, who was forged out from the gospels. Imagine what would you have written, if other gospels were kept in the cannon.

Four persons are alleged to be the authors of Distortion and confusion. Paul, with his personal letters and John with Revelation completed the disaster by laying the wrong foundation.

BMZ

_________________
Ali Sina:"Go to a public place, call friends with video and preferably the media as well. Then in front of everyone, remove your veil and set it on fire. Then announce in loud voice, "I am free" (Edited)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
HomoErectus
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 27 Nov 2007
Posts: 332


Location: Germany
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 5:05 am    Post subject: Re: textual criticism Reply with quote

BMZ wrote:


...completed the disaster by laying the wrong foundation.

BMZ



And that from you, with mohammad, islam, quran and ahadith "backing" you up !

I'm no defender of christianism, not at all, but thats just too much hypocrisy !

And your constant "retaliating" strategy, hammering on christianism, and thus TRYING to justify your own completely absurd belief-set, is just the same - absurd !

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not defending ANY religion !
But your retaliation in return for the constant hammering on islam is just too... transparent !

If it was for the IDEA behind a religion, I'd probably choose Buddhism, or maybe even "Jesuism" [not existent, I just created that corner], for the idea of LOVE...

While your religion only has hate, violence, threats, hellfire, kill kill kill, loot, enslave, ambush, and a claimed supremacy on top - and eternal damnation for "unbelievers" and "apostates"!

What a disgrace to an alleged "god" !
_________________
Upright is better than bent-over !
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ibnishaq
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 155


Location: USA
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
All_Brains
Master Administrator
Master Administrator


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 632



Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ibnishaq wrote:
i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc


Easy Shaq! because it was man-made!

And so is Islam! Please research how it was collected and when, it will show you that Islam is as suspicious as all its  Abrahamic siblings!
_________________
A little boy prayed for a bike. Then he realized God doesn't work that way so he stole a bike and asked for forgiveness.
www.all-brains.blogspot.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Tvebak
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 280


Location: Around
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All_Brains wrote:
ibnishaq wrote:
i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc


Easy Shaq! because it was man-made!

And so is Islam! Please research how it was collected and when, it will show you that Islam is as suspicious as all its  Abrahamic siblings!


Just my words A_B. The histories of the different 'sacred texts' shows very clearly that they are a product of their time, and they all got changed, enhanced, cut etc. to fit the ideas of the editors and the audience.
_________________
Yes, we have a "soul"; but it's made of lots of tiny robots. - Daniel Dennet

It's mine "." ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ibnishaq
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 155


Location: USA
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All_Brains wrote:
ibnishaq wrote:
i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc


Easy Shaq! because it was man-made!

And so is Islam! Please research how it was collected and when, it will show you that Islam is as suspicious as all its  Abrahamic siblings!


i have but i trust islamic sources on it. looking at science of hadiths and how many copies of quran and memorization i trust it.

but do explain how it is suspicious!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Pazuzu bin Hanbi
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 156


Location: Save Warp
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Indeed. Check the 3 pages on this site for example:

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/199901/koran
_________________
$_=q{$_=q{Q};s/Q/$_/;print};s/Q/$_/;print
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
All_Brains
Master Administrator
Master Administrator


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 632



Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ibnishaq wrote:
All_Brains wrote:
ibnishaq wrote:
i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc


Easy Shaq! because it was man-made!

And so is Islam! Please research how it was collected and when, it will show you that Islam is as suspicious as all its  Abrahamic siblings!


i have but i trust islamic sources on it. looking at science of hadiths and how many copies of quran and memorization i trust it.

but do explain how it is suspicious!


So do you trust the collection of that hadith where a she-monkey was stoned for adultery by other monkeys and the prophet and his mates helped along!????????????????????????????

You trust the source and disrespect your brain at the same time?
_________________
A little boy prayed for a bike. Then he realized God doesn't work that way so he stole a bike and asked for forgiveness.
www.all-brains.blogspot.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ibnishaq
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 155


Location: USA
Add Karma

rated by members
Add Comment
Show Comments


online/offline
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All_Brains wrote:
ibnishaq wrote:
All_Brains wrote:
ibnishaq wrote:
i am not speaking mainly about paul and john and that. i am speaking about HOW the bible was canonized and by who. like is the torah today written by moses or by 4 authors? most say 4!! who wrote esther, and was it originally pagan book about polytheism! did solomon really write his book! why did no early church writers quote 2 and 3 john or hebrews. why did some have a bigger canon? why do catholics have 7 extra books in their bible? why synoptic gospels? why do some versions of psalm have 151 chapters? why do dead sea scrolls have one version of isaiah that is 2/3 bigger then that today? why do only 60% of dead sea scrolls agree with Maseretic but 40% are differennt! etc


Easy Shaq! because it was man-made!

And so is Islam! Please research how it was collected and when, it will show you that Islam is as suspicious as all its  Abrahamic siblings!


i have but i trust islamic sources on it. looking at science of hadiths and how many copies of quran and memorization i trust it.

but do explain how it is suspicious!


So do you trust the collection of that hadith where a she-monkey was stoned for adultery by other monkeys and the prophet and his mates helped along!????????????????????????????

You trust the source and disrespect your brain at the same time?

it depends on if they are daeef mutuwwar etc!!!! it varies from hadith to hadith tho most seem authentic!

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FREE FAITH, EXPRESSION AND THOUGHT Forum Index -> Christianity All times are GMT + 11 Hours
Page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2
 
 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Card File  Gallery  Forum Archive
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum