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God's Literal Words?
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Tvebak
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: God's Literal Words?  Reply with quote

cosmicdancer wrote:
kafir forever wrote:
Quit whining


Whining?

Perhaps you could point out where I have been whining?

I thought my posts here on this thread and elsewhere have made some good points and been supportive of other ex-Muslims (such as ibn Ishaq)

But if you consider them to be whining then I shall spare you.

If my posts are not wanted or appreciated then I shall leave (this forum and all other forums) and you can remain and offer your expert opinions on all the ex-Muslim forums you like.

May I say goodbye and best wishes - particularly to my good friend All Brains, Tvebak, He and others.

Smile


Your posts are very much wanted and appreciated. I would personally love if you would continue contributing to the forums, and aswell continue to enlighten us all on you blog. But of course it's your personal choice.

And Hassan he did apologize for his outburst Wink  you have to give him some credit for that  Smile  It can be hard reading facial expression when reading some scripture on a flat, dead screen...

Kafirforever wrote:
My frustration is, that is is so obvious that is what is happening, and that it was intentionally designed by a madman to promote his brand of thuggery.  And the solution is also obvious and simple.


I agree completely with you on this, when thinking about many believers, and many doubters. It's the same story about dreadful fear of hell which probably lurk back in the mind. People react to these things in different ways. My wife grew up in a "freechurch" here in Denmark getting taught about hell and punishment in early sundayschools. It's horrible. Such things sometimes just stick to people and they can't get completely rid of it. She is today a 100 % social constructivist, hence she thinks that "god" is a created terme, but anyways she does not like to talk about "devil", "Memnoch", "satan", "lucifer" or what other names there's for the delightful caracter of the "holy" scriptures. It's not just like "that" for many people. It's can be a huge accomplishment to clear off the thoughts.
To lighten the mood, and put it in perspective the miss and I have just been watching season 7 of American Idol. Some of these persons who try out to become the next idol have a profound belief that they are the greatest singers in the world, and when they stand there infront of the judges it becomes perfectly clear that they don't have a single tone in their voice. NADA! It's utterly horrible. And they can't fathom why the judges don't like them and why Simon Cowell says that they are "scary" and it was "horrible", "the worst experience in my life" or "I can never listen to that song again". After being thrown out of the room they keep on ranting about their great talent and keep telling "america" that they will get to the top, no doubt that! That they can sing, and is one of the best singers in the world. The delusion is vast! It was not to make a comparison to religious people as such, even so some might go in the same category, but it is an example of how a belief can shield of every reasonable talk and there also some "fear" having a role here. The "fear" of not being able to sing. For some of these people it seems to have been one of the only things they have clinged to in their life. It's actually quite sad in some cases.

Well that was a rant about nothing, I might say "ooops I did again". Well my point was, KF, that it's most likely not as easy as it sounds for many people. And furthermore people tackle it in different ways. But concerning CD I have a feeling that he have tackled it, and in his one way.

All the best and peace to both of you  Wink
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello CD

KF is really a good person and he expresses his point of views from "never was Muslim" angle. a lot of people don't understand what's the big deal about leaving Islam and I have to agree that "some" of the hardship inflected are self-imposed!

Let me make this very clear CD, you're a good man who's pretty much liked by people from all the walks of life.

I know that you're a person who doesn't like conflicts so much, but I am afraid life is full of them. CD, you are now finding more and more about who you really are, what you believe in and what you want out of life. Going away from conflicts don't make conflicts go away. You need to alter the behaviour and win few life battles to build your self esteem again!

You have no idea how important your contribution here and I am so honoured and happy every time I log on and see one of your kind spirited posts that are capable of dissolving any theological differences!

CD...You represent humanity, kindness, art and genuine emotions in this forum and without you, there will be a big black hole of harsh rationality and stiff logic.

We love you man and we're truly your friends.

p.s: I believe that KF also apologised for the outburst and that's honourable in anyone's book!
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 2:17 pm    Post subject: Re: God's Literal Words? Reply with quote

cosmicdancer wrote:
kafir forever wrote:
Quit whining


Whining?

Perhaps you could point out where I have been whining?

I thought my posts here on this thread and elsewhere have made some good points and been supportive of other ex-Muslims (such as ibn Ishaq)

But if you consider them to be whining then I shall spare you.

If my posts are not wanted or appreciated then I shall leave (this forum and all other forums) and you can remain and offer your expert opinions on all the ex-Muslim forums you like.

May I say goodbye and best wishes - particularly to my good friend All Brains, Tvebak, He and others.

Smile


It this is all it takes to drive you away, then you have no self-esteem, and you confirm my assertions.  Get a backbone, man, and stand up for and defend your beliefs, whatever they might be, but do so with reason and conviction.

Whining may be the wrong observation.  Maybe, "Woa is me, I am the victim" might be more appropriate.

It is time for some tough love, dude.  Get a backbone and show it.

I am calling you out.  Stand up to me with conviction, pride and a rational argument, and tell me why you think the Islamic concept of Hell makes sense and justifies fear of it, or tell me why you think it is absurd.  If the former, you are not an apostate.  If the latter, you are on you way to freedom from this evil cult.  If you cannot do the latter, then you are not an apostate, and probably never will me.

BTW:  CD, It is only because I truly like you that I do this.

Come on, man, have it out with me.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Get some backbone? Thanks yet again for more insults. Perhaps you think this is the Wild West or the OK Corral and that calling me "Yeller" is going to make me draw my pistol. But I really have no time for this childishness.

I don't understand you KF - and you certainly don't understand me (though you think you do).

Tevbak asked if there was some sort of 'history' between us - well there is none that I am aware of. It simply appears that my posts irritate you - though I can't for the life of me see why?

But that's your problem - not mine - and I have better things to do than waste my time on a pointless argument where we simply shout past each other.

Again, my best wishes to you all (thanks for your kind words AB - I will be keeping up my Blog - hope to see you around.)

Hassan.

btw KF - I went to the Demo outside the Afghan Embassy yesterday - I got photographed and interviewed and gave my name and said I was an ex-Muslim and wanted to protest against the idea that anyone should be criminalised for simply criticising Islam. You talk about backbone - you have no idea.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 12:14 am    Post subject: Re: God's Literal Words? Reply with quote

kafir forever wrote:
 It this is all it takes to drive you away, then you have no self-esteem, and you confirm my assertions.  Get a backbone, man, and stand up for and defend your beliefs, whatever they might be, but do so with reason and conviction.

Whining may be the wrong observation.  Maybe, "Woa is me, I am the victim" might be more appropriate.

It is time for some tough love, dude.  Get a backbone and show it.

I am calling you out.  Stand up to me with conviction, pride and a rational argument, and tell me why you think the Islamic concept of Hell makes sense and justifies fear of it, or tell me why you think it is absurd.  If the former, you are not an apostate.  If the latter, you are on you way to freedom from this evil cult.  If you cannot do the latter, then you are not an apostate, and probably never will me.

BTW:  CD, It is only because I truly like you that I do this.

Come on, man, have it out with me.


CD is a very kind and noble person and I have never seen him involved in harsh and vulgur exchanges. You have never been an apostate, so you will not be able to understand what goes in his mind.

For a true ex-Muslim, it is very hard to throw all feelings for Islam. CD is not like every other poster that you come across. That is something you ought to know. Moreover, you will never see any vulgarity coming from a genuine and bonafide ex-Muslim.

Just take a look at A_B. He doesn't do that. And that is why I am here. You have to learn to read a poster's mind and then write accordingly.

Could you write the same way to Ali Sina, if you stand up with any conviction? You just accept what he says blindly and you come after a person who is not used to polemics.

Cheers
BMZ

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmicdancer wrote:
btw KF - I went to the Demo outside the Afghan Embassy yesterday - I got photographed and interviewed and gave my name and said I was an ex-Muslim and wanted to protest against the idea that anyone should be criminalised for simply criticising Islam. You talk about backbone - you have no idea.


Hello CD,

Quote:
When the going gets tough, the tough get going.


My hat off to you for saying that. I have mentioned about you on other sites, standing boldy to show what you are.

Many people who stand for saying something do not really stand openly to show the conviction they stand for. Ali Sina failed to do that and you did it publicly.

I would leave a site when I notice that most of the posters are presenting nothing but junk and stuff. And I would not leave a site just because of one person.

You need friends and I think you have many here. You should not go.

Salaams
BMZ

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BMZ wrote:

You need friends and I think you have many here. You should not go.

Salaams


Salams BMZ - and thank you Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BMZ wrote:
cosmicdancer wrote:
btw KF - I went to the Demo outside the Afghan Embassy yesterday - I got photographed and interviewed and gave my name and said I was an ex-Muslim and wanted to protest against the idea that anyone should be criminalised for simply criticising Islam. You talk about backbone - you have no idea.


Hello CD,

Quote:
When the going gets tough, the tough get going.


My hat off to you for saying that. I have mentioned about you on other sites, standing boldy to show what you are.

Many people who stand for saying something do not really stand openly to show the conviction they stand for. Ali Sina failed to do that and you did it publicly.

I would leave a site when I notice that most of the posters are presenting nothing but junk and stuff. And I would not leave a site just because of one person.

You need friends and I think you have many here. You should not go.

Salaams
BMZ


You're a good man BMZ! If only all religious people are like ypu, this forum wouldn't even exist!

I am proud to have you in this forum.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmicdancer wrote:
Get some backbone? Thanks yet again for more insults. Perhaps you think this is the Wild West or the OK Corral and that calling me "Yeller" is going to make me draw my pistol. But I really have no time for this childishness.

I don't understand you KF - and you certainly don't understand me (though you think you do).

Tevbak asked if there was some sort of 'history' between us - well there is none that I am aware of. It simply appears that my posts irritate you - though I can't for the life of me see why?

But that's your problem - not mine - and I have better things to do than waste my time on a pointless argument where we simply shout past each other.

Again, my best wishes to you all (thanks for your kind words AB - I will be keeping up my Blog - hope to see you around.)

Hassan.

btw KF - I went to the Demo outside the Afghan Embassy yesterday - I got photographed and interviewed and gave my name and said I was an ex-Muslim and wanted to protest against the idea that anyone should be criminalised for simply criticising Islam. You talk about backbone - you have no idea.


Just for the records, you're very courageous Hassan in my book!

KF does not understand that you still sympathise with some aspects of Islam and Muslim culture.

May be I should make it clear that the aim of this forum was never to eradicate Islam or any other faith for that matter. This forum is to encourage people to think, critique and question their thoughts and beliefs, so that they may be set free from ignorant and fearful indoctrination.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmicdancer wrote:


btw KF - I went to the Demo outside the Afghan Embassy yesterday - I got photographed and interviewed and gave my name and said I was an ex-Muslim and wanted to protest against the idea that anyone should be criminalised for simply criticising Islam. You talk about backbone - you have no idea.


Another salute to you Hassan. I admire your "backbone" lol. No really I admire you. Has the demonstration had any impact on the media. I haven't found anything on the subject yet.

Peace


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