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3 Questions to abandon religion (By Brainout)
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HomoErectus
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:23 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote

You got it... its opposed to the "Homo Limpus" ! Laughing

Who got eradicated in Brisbane Australia.
Maybe All_Brains has some on him?

Anyway, it proved to better being "erectus", spotting them gators a bit earlier, thus enabling the Homo to rrrruuunnnnnnnn....


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey, you'd like this story
http://users.bigpond.net.au/manisall/world.html
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good one!
Btw, thanks for drawing my attention to deMello, already on FFI!
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Upright is better than bent-over !


Yes, as they say, it is better to give than to receive  Laughing
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mutley wrote:
Quote:
Upright is better than bent-over !


Yes, as they say, it is better to give than to receive  Laughing


Its always a "give and take" Laughing
And I've also "recieved" in an upright position !
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HomoErectus wrote:
Mutley wrote:
Quote:
Upright is better than bent-over !


Yes, as they say, it is better to give than to receive  Laughing


Its always a "give and take" Laughing
And I've also "recieved" in an upright position !


Laughing   Laughing   Laughing

Yes, there are some that would swallow that story. Laughing  Butt knot me  Laughing   Laughing
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mutley wrote:


Laughing   Laughing   Laughing

Yes, there are some that would swallow that story. Laughing  Butt knot me  Laughing   Laughing



Well, it all cums free of charges.
People swallow a lot, if its GRATIS !

Thats why ! Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:48 am    Post subject: Re: 3 Questions to abandon religion (By Brainout) Reply with quote

admin wrote:
Brainout wrote:

What ought to be the three questions which make a person leave a faith, whether Islam or any other? Thinking out loud (reserving the right to change my mind), I come up with these three:

1. The Character of the "God" depicted is unfair, silly, capricious, ungodlike, in its holy books. For "God" would have to be "Infinite" by definition, and it's not Infinity if not Love. Else being "God" would be a torture beyond comprehension, and everyone (including God) would be destroyed, by now. (Of course, that favors a conclusion that there is no God, too.)

In other words, I'd not listen to what people SAY about the holy book, I'd examine it on its own terms. Like All-Brains said, people use religion for power. Religion to me is a satanic thing in any 'flavor' and has aught to do with "God".

2. The creation of the "God" depicted is treated as pets, slaves, automatons or other hapless toy. A real God wouldn't get any enjoyment out of such creation, so a book depicting his creation in that manner can't be written through/by/ "God". Even we can't long bear babyish or stupid people in companionship.

3. The end result of all the evil in the world existing for millennia had better demonstrate a purpose which makes 100% good on it. For after all, "God" would have to put up with it all forever, if "God" is omniscient. So if some holy book doesn't show how all that suffering is made-good-on, then that book doesn't come from "God".

Of course, one could argue that no holy book ever written meets all those three tests. Smile Obviously I think Bible does, but that's only my opinion, and is subject to change at any moment, if I find it wrong.

Seems to me that if one respects the Koran, Bhagavad Gita, or whatever other holy book, these three criteria would be useful? Again, just thinking out loud.


I suggest not lumping the Gita which is an eastern text with books such as the Koran and Bible as the spirituality and philosophy contained within it is radically different from that of Abrahamic religions.

All_Brains wrote:
Hello Brainout

I am afraid that all current religions fail to meet all three criterion including Christianity, for God there still has a very unconvincing story of the creation and the purpose of it all.

God still is responsible for all evil, as he created Satan. He can make it all stop if he wanted.

But remember before the light was created by God, darkness existed! Could Satan and God be equal to achieve a balance? Could they be both eternal independent beings?

I believe not, but it's a good theory to look at, as I think it would lead to how humans invented these concepts from day one and they have evolved with them throughout the ages. The ultimate good vs. evil, yin and yang, the competition, the match...the religious sport!


There is no concept of "creation" and "satan" in eastern religions. It is best if you specify "Abrahamic religions" or "western religions" when discussing such concepts.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brainout wrote:
Mathematically, if relativity exists, then the absolute exists.  One should argue therefore that there is a spiritual counterpart.  If finity exists, an Absolute Creator of it also exists.


Here is where you are wrong. Anything that creates has potential energy and is therefore mutable. If it is mutable, it is no longer absolute but also relative.

To understand the absolute reality, you must throw this concept of a "creator" also known as "god" into the garbage. Advaita therefore states that the absolute reality is akarta (a non agent).

Quote:
No set can contain itself, but can only be contained within a larger set than itself, or a set which is of the same size as itself: this is the first rule of math, and really of genetics as well (the offspring can be no greater than the parents, even if "parents" is many generations back).

So if infinite regression or progression, an infinite STASIS must likewise exist. If -1, then 0. If 0, then +1. It becomes, mathematically speaking, a HUPOSTASIS, "hupo" meaning "under", and "stasis" meaning "standing", so you get the understanding of one thing standing under another thing: union of opposites, with the result that a full spectrum is 'held together' by the larger stasis.


This is a very pantheistic understanding of the universe. But note that anything that contains opposites is once again relative, not absolute. To truly progress from relativity to absolutism, you must discard the idea of relativity existing within the absolute, and theorize that relativity is actually superimposed on the absolute, which is basically transitioning from pantheism to monism.

Quote:
This means that the infinite progression or regression can keep on going, as the stasis IS a stasis, 'holding' it. Kinda like your body is moving inside, all those ribosomes and other activity, yet your outer body looks the same (pretend for the sake of this example that your outer body didn't age).

Logically, this would have to mean that the infinite progression and regression are 'under' the Stasis of ALL AT ONCE. Again, this all-at-onceness would have to be Living, Conscious, else where does our own livingness and consciousness come from?


Consciousness is mutable. Ones thoughts and feelings are constantly changing and are relative to what happens around us. Again, the absolute must be above all such things. Only pure awareness remains constant and is not relative to what occurs around us.

Quote:
Notice that science doesn't have to touch "God" issues to evaluate all this, and cannot, since a STASIS of infinity would be wholly undetectable by any physical instruments. The ultimate existence would have to be immaterial and absolute, personal and alive. Science would never be able to detect that. However, again from the oppositeness we can measure materially, its opposite of infinite static Live Immateriality, is 'reflected' so to speak.


Science may not be able to detect the absolute reality, but we can, as the absolute reality is awareness, which we possess. This attempt to detect the absolute is the central premise of Hinduism and Mahayana Buddhism.

Quote:
Again, mathematically, Truth cannot hang together as a whole set, if incomplete or self-contradicting. And if the ultimate set must be Living and Conscious (again, because animacy must beget inanimacy, it can't be the other way around), then "Truth" would have to be an attribute of "God".


Wrong again - look at nature - animacy always comes from inanimacy. Example: a tree growing out of a seed, entirely out of physical processes. It is from simplicity that complexity evolves, not the other way around.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: 3 Questions to abandon religion (By Brainout) Reply with quote

roshan wrote:


There is no concept of "creation" and "satan" in eastern religions. It is best if you specify "Abrahamic religions" or "western religions" when discussing such concepts.


I have altered the title of this forum to reflect that. Thanks for the feedback!


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