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Miracles in the Quran

 
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AhmedBahgat
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:50 am    Post subject: Miracles in the Quran  Reply with quote

Salam all

As you may know that I decided not to post on www.faithfreedom.org for a very long time, I'm still reading them though and is very tempted to post seeing the bigotery and confusion by such goons in there, but I have to stick to my words and save my valuable time doing more important work, today however I noticed a thread by Ali Sina named Miracles in the Quran, and I'm always curious to read what those goons write about the Quran so I read it

Please note that Ali posted a qoute from an email that he received, here is the quote from such email first

Quote:
I  have been very much influenced by your writings however i came across this today which is very confusing . these are some stated miricles of muhammad. i believed in islam for 15 years. i never left even when doubts began to come up mainly out of fear of hell. i was raised catholic and am now 44 . i have explored relgion trying to find the "truth" since i was 14!!!! im discouraged and i feel like im going to hell because i havent found convincing evidence yet. What am i supposed to tell my boys? i feel like its an endless battle. people tell me jesus is god  and if you dont believe you go to hell,muslims say youll go to hell if you believe he is god!! i am very distressed . i would appreciate your opinion on this article on muhammads miricles. the reason i felt comfortable leaving islam was because you wrote he performed no miricles. it was like a light bulb went off- i was so releaved to feel i wouldnt go to hell and it was a false religion. now i see this!!  please your input and thougts are needed.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 2, Book 13, Number 55:
Narrated Anas bin Malik:
Once in the lifetime of the Prophet (p.b.u.h) the people were afflicted with drought (famine). While the Prophet was delivering the Khutba on a Friday, a Bedouin stood up and said, "O, Allah's Apostle! Our possessions are being destroyed and the children are hungry; Please invoke Allah (for rain)". So the Prophet raised his hands. At that time there was not a trace of cloud in the sky. By Him in Whose Hands my soul is as soon as he lowered his hands, clouds gathered like mountains, and before he got down from the pulpit, I saw the rain falling on the beard of the Prophet. It rained that day, the next day, the third day, the fourth day till the next Friday. The same Bedouin or another man stood up and said, "O Allah's Apostle! The houses have collapsed, our possessions and livestock have been drowned; Please invoke Allah (to protect us)". So the Prophet I raised both his hands and said, "O Allah! Round about us and not on us". So, in whatever direction he pointed with his hands, the clouds dispersed and cleared away, and Medina's (sky) became clear as a hole in between the clouds. The valley of Qanat remained flooded, for one month, none came from outside but talked about the abundant rain.

From ‘Ibn Kathirs The Life of the Prophet Muhammad, Al-sira Al-Nabawiyya, volume 2’ :


HOW THE PROPHET (SAAS) REPLACED QATADA’S EYE:

Al-Bayhaqi stated, in the Dalail (The Signs), “Abu Sad al-Malini informed us quoting Abu Ahmed b. Adi, quoting Abu Yala, quoting Yahya al-Himmant, quoting Abd al-Aziz b. Sulayman b. al-Ghasil, from Asim b. Umar b. Qatada, from his father, from his grandfather Qatada b. al-Numan, that his eye was wounded at Badr and that its pupil came down on his cheekbone. They were about to slice it off, but asked the Messenger of God (SAAS) who said they should not do this. He then said a prayer for him, covering his cheek with his palm. And later you could not tell which of his eyes had been struck!”
According to one account, this became the better eye.
An account came down to us from the Commander of the Believers, Umar b. Abd al- Aziz that when he was told this account by Asim b. Umar b. Qatada, he also recited:  
“I am the son of him on whose cheek his eye descended,
which was replaced so well by the hand of the Chosen-One.”

Upon hearing this, Umar b. Abd al-Aziz, God bless him, quoted very appropriately the verse of Umayya b. Abd al-Salt of Ibn Dhu Yazin,

“These fine qualities are not like two bowls with milk
merely whitening the water that soon becomes urine.” (Pg 298)
 
Section: Concerning the Splitting of the Moon in the time of the Prophet (SAAS)


God did provide the Messenger of God (SAAS) with a sign to prove the veracity of the guidance and religion of truth he brought, and that was at the time of his pointing (to the moon).

God Almighty spoke the following in his noble book, “The hour has drawn near and the moon has split asunder. And if they see a sign they turn away, saying, ‘Just more trickery!’ They call it deceit and follow their fancies, while all things are pre-determined.” (surat al-Qamar, LIV, v.1-3)

Muslims are agreed that this did occur in the time of the Messenger of God (SAAS), traditions with complete lines of transmissions, through numerous paths, provide decisive proof for those who examine it and comprehend it.

…….That is related from Anas b. Malik, Jubayr b. Mutim, Hudhayfa, Abd Allah b. Abbas, Abd Allah b. Umar, and Abd Allah b. Masud, God be pleased with all.

Regarding the hadith of Anas, Imam Ahmad stated, “Abd al-Raziq related to us that Mamar related to him, from Qatada, from Anas b. Malik, who said, ‘ The people of Mecca asked the prophet (SAAS) for a sign, And so the moon over Mecca was split twice. And he spoke the words, “ The house has drawn near and the moon has split asunder”” (surat al-Qamar, LIV, v-1)

And Muslim related this, from Muhammad b. Rafi from from Abd al-Razzaq.

This is one of the texts known as the mursalat al-sahaba. And it is plain that he received it from a large mass of the Companions, or from the Prophet (SAAS), or from everyone.

Both al-Bukhari and Muslim related this hadith on a path through Shayban. In his line of transmission al-Bukhari added Said b. Abu Urba. Muslim added Shuba to his. All three (sic) of them drew from Qatada, from Anas. The tradition states that the people of Mecca asked the Messenger of God (SAAS) to show them a sign, He showed them the moon in two parts, so that they could see Mt. Hira between them both.

……. The Hafiz Abu Nuaym stated, “Sulayman b. Ahmad related to us, quoting Bakr b. Suhayl, quoting Abd al-Ghani b. Said, quoting Musa b. Abd al-Rahman, from Ibn Jurayj, from Ata, from Ibn Abbas- also, it came from Muqatil, from al- Dahhak, from Ibn Abbas- with reference to God’s words, ‘The hour has drawn near and the moon has been split asunder’, as follows, ‘The polytheists gathered around the Messenger of God (SAAS); they included al-Walid b. al-Mughira, Abu Jahl b. Hisham, al-As b. Wail, al-As b. Hisham, al-Aswad b. Abd Yaghuth, al-Aswad b. Muttalib b. Asad b. Abd al-Uzza, Zama b. al-Aswad and al-Nadr b. al-Harith, along with many other such men.

“They said to the Prophet (SAAS), “If you are telling the truth, then split the moon for us into two parts, one half over Mt. Abu Qubays, the other over Mt. Quayquan. The Prophet (SAAS) asked them, “If I did so, would you believe?” “Yes, we would,” they replied. It was a night of full moon, and so he asked God the Almighty and Glorious to grant him what they requested. That evening the moon did have one half removed and placed over Mt. Abu Abu Qubays, the other being above Mt. Quayquan, while the Messenger of God (SAAS) called out, “O Abu Salama b. Abd al-Asad, and al-Aqram b. al-Aqram, be a witness (to this event).”

…..The Hafiz Abu al-Qasim al- Tabarni said, “Ahmad b. al-Amr al-Razzaz related to us, quoting Muhammad b. Yahya al-Qital, quoting Muhammad b. Bakr quoting Ibn Jurayj quoting Amr b. Dinar, from Ikrima, from Ibn Abbas, who said, ‘ In the time of the Messenger of God (SAAS), the moon was eclipsed and people said, “The moon is bewitched!” And so the words were revealed, “The hour has drawn near and the moon has split asunder. And if they see a sign they turn away saying, “Just more trickery!”’”(surat al-Qamar, LIV, v. 1-3).

This has a fine chain of authorities; it states that the moon was eclipsed that night; perhaps its splitting occurred on the night of its eclipse and this is why what happened to it was hidden from most of the earths inhabitants. However, this was in fact witnessed in parts of the world. It is said that in some parts of India that became a point dating, and that a building was constructed that night which was dated by the night the moon was split. (Pg 76-79)

A Miraculous event:


Section: Concerning the isra, the night journey, of the Messenger of God (SAAS) from Mecca to Jerusalem, his ascent from there to heaven and the signs he saw there.

We will give here the gist of the words of Ibn Ishaq, God bless him. Having recounted the earlier sections, he went on, “Then the Messenger of God (SAAS) was taken by night from the masjid-al haram to the masjid al-aqsa, the latter being the holy temple of Aelia. By then Islam had spread in Mecca into Quraysh and all the Arab tribes.”

He continued, “Concerning the night journey of the Messenger of God (SAAS), I learned what follows from a hadith that came down from Ibn Musud, Abu Said, Aisha, Muawiya, Umm Hani, daughter of Abu Talib, God bless them all, and al-Hasan b. Abu al-Hasan, Ibn Hisham al-Zuhri, Qatada and other scholars. Individually that combines in this account.

“The night journey of the Messenger of God (SAAS) was filled with trials and tribulations and (instances) of God’s power and authority; it provides a lesson for men of intelligence, a guidance, a mercy and an affirmation for those with faith and belief. It was certainly an act of God.

“He carried him on his journey as and how He wished, to show him those of His signs He desired. He thus surveyed some of the Might of God, His will, power and authority by which he accomplishes His purposes.

“Abd Allah b. Masud would say, as I have been informed, the Messenger of God (SAAS), was brought al-Buraq, that being the name of a mount on which previous prophets were carried; its stride was such that it could place its hooves as far as it could see. He was borne away on it.

“His companion (Gabriel) then took him off to see signs between heaven and earth. Eventually he reached Jerusalem, where he found Abraham, Moses and Jesus, in a company of prophets assembled for him. He led them in prayer. “Then he was brought three vessels, containing milk, wine and water. He said that he drank the vessel of milk and was told by Gabriel, ‘You have been given guidance, and so has your nation.’”

…..Ibn Ishaq related, quoting Umm Hani as his source, that she said, “It was from nowhere but my home that the Messenger of God (SAAS) made his night journey. He slept that night after having made the final evening prayer. When it was just before dawn he woke up and when it was morning we prayed together and he said, ‘O Umm Hani, last evening I prayed with you in this valley, then I went to Jerusalem and prayed there. And now here I am having said the morning prayer with you, as you see.’

“He then arose to leave, but I took hold of the hem of his cloak and said, ‘O Messenger of God, do not make that statement to the people; they will surely disbelieve you and do you harm.’

“But he replied, ‘By God, I will certainly tell it to them!’ And he did tell them and they did disbelieve.”

Ibn Ishaq went on (and the Prophet (SAAS) told the sceptical, tr.) “And the proof of this is that I passed by the caravan of such-and-such a tribe in such-and-such a valley, and the sound of (al-buraq) startled them and so one of their camels ran away. I led them to it, being then on my way to al-Sham. Then I continued on until I reached Dajanan, where I passed a caravan of such-and-such tribe. I found the people asleep. They had a vessel with water in it that they had covered it with something. I took off the cover and drank the water and replaced its cover. And the proof of this is that their caravan is now making its way down from the pass at al-Tanim al-Bayda. Leading it is an ash-coloured camel on which are two sacks, one of which is black, the other black and white.

“On hearing this, people hurried to the pass. The first camel, which was as he described to them, was insufficient proof for them, so they asked about the vessel and the camel, and those in the caravan did tell them just as the Prophet (SAAS) had recounted.”

Yunus b. bukayr related, from Asbat, from Ismail al-Suddi, that the sun had almost set before that caravan arrived and so he prayed to God, Almighty and Glorious is He, who slowed it down until they came, just as he had described it to them.

He stated, “And the sun was never slowed down for anyone except on that day for him, and also for Yusha (Joshua) b. Nun.

Al-Bayhaqi related this account. ( Pg 62-64)


So as we can see, the prophet Muhammad performed several miracles, and also went through a miraculous event when he was taken from Mecca to Jerusalem, where he saw all the other prophets and was taken into heaven.

So the claim that the prophet Muhammad had no miracles is a lie.


Rebuttals, and exposing the lies of the Answering Islam team section.
Prophet Muhammad's (peace be upon him) section.
Islam and the Noble Quran - Questions and Answers.
Contradictions and History of Corruption in the Bible.
Rebuttals to Sam Shamoun's Articles section.
Sami Zaatari's Rebuttals section.




AS you have seen above the post by such person was not about the Quran, rather about the alleged miracles of Mohammed, yet Ali Sina as always manipulates the facts by nameing his thread, Miracles in the Quran, I really can't believe that all of the goons on his web site never pick on his clear cut manipulations, they are like puppets to him btw, you should see the first filthy puppet named fire-snake replying first with her usual crap :

http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=53919


Here is Ali Sina's reply to the above:

Ali Sina wrote:
Hello Terry (Name changed)
Any Muslim will tell you that if there is a contradiction between the Quran and a hadith, the Quran should be taken as valid and that hadith is false. Please click on this link and see for yourself how many times Muhammad denied being able to perform miracles.
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina/miracles_of_Mo.htm


Ahmed says:

Hahahaha, see how double faced such person is, now he is using the argument that every single Muslim should know and accept (DESPITE THE REALITY TELLS US SOMETHING ELSE), in this case however Ali Sina is telling us that because the Quran says Mohammed performed no miracles then it should invalidate all those hearsay hadith posted by the guy above which allege that  Mohammed did many miracles

On the other hand, the other face of Ali Sina accepts all other hearsay hadith that allege that  Mohammed stoned the Zani and Zania, while the Quran invalidate such hearsay of hadith because the Quran clearly tells us that the punishment of the Zani and Zania is 100 lashes in public

see how double faced such man is, here is what he has to say to clearly expose his double faced and convict his own arse:

Ali Sina wrote:
As per Quran we know that any hadith that attributes miracles to Muhammad is false.
 


SEE, I GOT HIM RED HANDED INDULGED IN HIS DECEPTION TWO TIMES IN HIS OWN THREAD

Salam all
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your allegation against him has no basis and here is why:

*You* are making claim that koran is from a god.
*You* are making claim that hadith can *not* contradict koran.

All *I* have to do, is find a contradiction between a hadith and a koran to repudiate a Hadith, as far as *you* are concerned.

*I* could also state that *your* Koran is fake.

Today however, I will choose to just point at a contradiction between *your* koran and *your* hadith.


*I* Do Not even need, to believe the *superiority* of koran over hadith. I just need to prove an inconsistency and then send you on your way.


Here is an analogy of what just happened:

*I* state that Earth is a *Cube*.
*I* state that all planets are *Triangles*.
*You* can prove to the world I am wrong because I am contradicting myself. You do not have to believe anything is a Cube or a Triangle.

It is not *your* fault that *I* made a contradiction. My claims are not even worth of being discussed on their own merits since *I* am contradicting myself.

You are the One making the Positive claim that the koran is superior to the hadith. Either defend your claim either take it back. But as long as you uphold such a claim, I am free to use it to negate your hadith claim.

*I* am not going to spend days and days researching the Hadith Miracles when *you* are incapable of even acknowledging them.

And always remember, *I* have absolutely no reason to accept that a koran is always more correct then a hadith.


PS: What's wrong with the title being miracles in the quoran? The subject dealt with the miracles using the koran. You are nit-picking. Stay away from philosophy. Stick to translation and interpretation.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baal wrote:
Your allegation against him has no basis and here is why:

*You* are the one making claim the koran is the word of a god.
*You* are the one making claim that the hadith can not contradict the koran.

All *I* have to do, is find a contradiction between a hadith and a koran to repudiate a Hadith.

*I* could also state that *your* Koran is fake.

Today however, I will choose to just point at a contradiction between *your* koran and *your* hadith.


*I* Do not need to believe the superiority of the koran over hadith. I just need to prove an inconsistency and then send you on your way.


Here is an analogy of what just happened:

*I* state that Earth is a *Cube*.
*I* state that all planets are *Triangles*.
*You* can prove to the world I am wrong because I am contradicting myself. You do not have to believe anything is a Cube or a Triangle.

It is not *your* fault that *I* made a contradiction. My claims are not even worth of being discussed on their own merits since *I* am contradicting myself.

You are the One making the Positive claim that the koran is superior to the hadith. Either defend your claim either take it back. But as long as you uphold such a claim, I am free to use it to negate your hadith claim.

*I* am not going to spend days and days researching the Hadith Miracles when *you* are incapable of even acknowledging them.

And always remember, *I* have absolutely no reason to accept that a koran is always more correct then a hadith.



nothing but total crap to be honest

the guy is using using the quran to claim that those hearsay hadith informing us about Mohammed miracles must be false, while the confused man is turning a blind eye that the Quran must make the stoning hadith nullied

baal, I have no time for your bigotry
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you want?
Anything you do or say can and will be used against you.

You are the One making the positive statement. All I have to do is find contradiction in *your* statements. I do not have to *believe* a single one of your Statements to be True.

You are making the positive statement: koran is true.
You are making the positive statement: koran is superior.

Some guy wants to make a case of a hadith against a koran. What do you think I should answer him?

I will point to him *he* made a contradiction and *send* him back to his drawing board.

Let him try to prove why his hadith is superior to his koran. Fvck him the idiot.

Really, Answer my point or retract your accusation.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What point you dick?


If your master A S agrees that anything  in hadith that contradicts the Quran must be false according to the Muslims then he must fukin agree that all those stonning verses are false

a double faced he is and you too sound like triple faced

cheers
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AhmedBahgat wrote:
What point you dick?


If your master A S agrees that anything  in hadith that contradicts the Quran must be false according to the Muslims then he must fukin agree that all those stonning verses are false

a double faced he is and you too sound like triple faced

cheers

Again, swearing and making claims to some degrees. Just answer the question.

That 44yr old Catholic Fake Froot, is trying to make an *impossible* story according to *islamic* standard.

Why should we entertain the Froot's *impossible* notion.

Let the Froot, explain to us, why is his Hadith superior to the Koran.

The Froot  is welcome to stick to his story. He is welcome to stick to his Hadith Miracles. But then the ball is in his court to try to explain how can he make a point in favor of the islamic story, yet accepts a hadith superior to the koran.

Ali being a non-muslim, it is conceivable for him to use a hadith that contradicts the koran. Even though Ali's point weaken, when you bring up the Lashing verse. Ali then has to bring up the hadith of aisha and the goat that ate the Surat. Ali has to bring the large numbers of stories around each stoning, from several sources.

That Froot is still within his right to try to defend the miracles. But he still has to explain that little koran problem. Just like Ali had to with his stoning.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will answer with a different point:
AhmedBahgat wrote:

If your master A S agrees that anything  in hadith that contradicts the Quran must be false according to the Muslims then he must fukin agree that all those stonning verses are false

It does *not* matter if I or A.Sina, agree that hadith can *not* contradict the koran. We are *not* muslims. This Miracle Guy, *wants* to be a muslim, *he* has to explain why is he contradicting the islamic (positive claims).

The Froot is welcome to continue to ignore the islamic (positive claims), but then he will be addressing a different audience then faithful muslims. An audience that possibly you, me and Ali do not care about.

When Ali ignores the islamic positive claim, then Ali is *also* talking to a different audience. As Ali stated, only when a muslim's intelligence surpasses his faith, will he leave his faith. Ali is addressing intelligent people according to him. Not, the faithful people. The faithful who actually believe the koran is superior might negate the Stoning stories. But then, there is a whole other audience of muslim who are confused about whether lashes applies to married people or stoning applies.

And there is a whole set of islamic audience that believes that a ruler has the right to "Taghleez Al Hudud" (Increasing the Punishment) as he sees fit. Those are *also* Ali's audience.

I do not know what was this Froot addressing. People who believe in miracles? the Faithful? good luck to him, he is confused.

AhmedBahgat wrote:

cheers

Cheers,

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